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By DZ0707Johnny
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Posts:  3
Joined:  Thu Apr 15, 2021 2:02 am
#378278
Lol that person from discord would be me.
Just here to spectate
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By DeadlyCarnivore
Posts:  324
Joined:  Sun Oct 23, 2016 6:17 am
#378283
I'm gonna say... without pictures of the plants that grew, its fake.

Does not seem possible at all.

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By Matt
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Joined:  Mon Apr 21, 2008 11:28 pm
#378284
Oh man, I read those same posts 12 years ago!! A trip down memory lane :lol:

I agree with @DeadlyCarnivore. I too came to the conclusion that there wasn't any validity to a true Dionaea/Drosera cross.

Over the years of me loosely watching the Dionaea world, I do recall several people trying to cross Dionaea with Drosera but, to my knowledge, there was never any success and I've never ever seen any photo evidence of such a thing. I think that Dionaea and Drosera are simply not closely related enough to be crossed in a traditional plant sex (pollen on a receptive flower stigma) way. There might be some wiggle room for a mad scientist to do something crazy in a lab setting, but that's way beyond my knowledge level and I've never read anything about anyone trying genetic splicing (i.e. CRISPR or whatever) with Dionaea in a lab.

I hope one of you young intelligent people I see roaming about in the CP world will be the first to do it!
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By DeadlyCarnivore
Posts:  324
Joined:  Sun Oct 23, 2016 6:17 am
#378300
Adrian Slack being mentioned does make me wonder though, as he is well known for cultivating Cps. If he was able to do it, something might be possible? But you would have to ask him directly if it was a rumor or not. The fact that no one has been able to do it again since him (if he was able to even create a cross like that in the first place) does make it seem like it was just a rumor.

With what I know, which is like nothing haha, is that gametic incompatability(prezygotic barrier) gets in the way. The pollen from one plant cant fertilize the eggs of another plant. But I am not sure if there are crazy, one in a million chances, hence why Adrian was able to get one that eventually died, and the person who wrote that stuff in the links was able to get some seeds that look like they were swelling. If it is possible, a postzygotic barrier gets in the way, and the plants just dont do well genetically, which is why they would grow horribly and then just die... That is where the crazy lab stuff Matt mentioned would help, if it is even possible. I dont know a lot, still havent gotten to the real biology stuff in college yet, haha.

I was going to say more but I am reading a journal on the relationship of Drosera, Dionea, and Aldrovanda and its confusing the crap out of me Aldrovanda and Drosera show a sister relationship, meaning they split from the same "node" in the evolutionary tree and are the closest related, and Dionea is the sister to that pair... This journal was published in 2002, so there are probably newer articles out there on the subject too.

It seems that if anything, Aldrovanda and Drosera would have the highest chances of producing offspring thouugh, considering they are the the ones that are closely related to eachother.

Speciation has also probably caused them to be too different, hence why they cannot cross breed... which is where my knowledge on stuff starts to end, as I did not pay enough attention in AP Bio. Dont take everything I say as fact, for that very reason, haha.

TL:DR: Doesnt seem possible, but if it was, crazy lab stuff would be how it could be achieved. Aldrovanda/Drosera would also probably be the best bet when wanting to cross breed, not drosera/dionea or aldrovanda/dionea. Also that I barely know what I am talking about, so I am probably wrong.

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By MikeB
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Posts:  569
Joined:  Sat Apr 25, 2020 4:13 pm
#378326
I think this hybrid is about as likely as crossing a horse with an antelope.
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By Nepenthes0260
Posts:  1084
Joined:  Mon Apr 30, 2018 1:59 am
#378340
Very interesting article, thanks for sharing!!

Firstly, those names are credible Drosera people. Sean Samia either has the largest or second largest Petiolaris Drosera collection in the states and Ivan Snyder is a Drosera fanatic as well, he's made some cool hybrids including 'Dr. Frankensnyder's Monster'.

I think trying to cross a Dionaea with a D. burmannii or brevifolia absolutely would not work. Not even all Drosera sp. are compatible (actually, most Drosera are not compatible), so thinking that plants like burmannii that have evolved far away from Dionaea can cross together seems crazy. Probably a lot of people would think D. falconeri can hybridize with a Dionaea but, while morphologically similar, falco isn't any more closely related to Dionaea than any of the other petiolaris dews.

D. regia would be the best option. While it doesn't look anything like Dionaea, it is still the closest relative to it, so has the closest genetics. Here's a great chart for Drosera genetics on the ICPS-https://www.carnivorousplants.org/cp/ev ... aPhylogeny
Still, the hybrid would be very doubtful, and I can't even begin to imagine what regia x VFT would look like :lol:.

Just for the sake of it, I did try pollinating one of my regia flowers with some Low Giant x B52 pollen. I'll update if anything comes out of it, but I am very, very doubtful :lol:
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By Matt
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Joined:  Mon Apr 21, 2008 11:28 pm
#378343
Nepenthes0260 wrote:Just for the sake of it, I did try pollinating one of my regia flowers with some Low Giant x B52 pollen. I'll update if anything comes out of it, but I am very, very doubtful
Nepenthes0260 wrote:Oops, just re-read the article, looks like Low Giant x B52 is going to be the female parent and regia is going to be the pollen donor.
Cool, keep us posted!!
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By hungrycarnivores
Posts:  105
Joined:  Mon Feb 22, 2021 9:53 pm
#378345
Nepenthes0260 wrote: Thu Apr 15, 2021 6:45 pm Very interesting article, thanks for sharing!!

Firstly, those names are credible Drosera people. Sean Samia either has the largest or second largest Petiolaris Drosera collection in the states and Ivan Snyder is a Drosera fanatic as well, he's made some cool hybrids including 'Dr. Frankensnyder's Monster'.

I think trying to cross a Dionaea with a D. burmannii or brevifolia absolutely would not work. Not even all Drosera sp. are compatible (actually, most Drosera are not compatible), so thinking that plants like burmannii that have evolved far away from Dionaea can cross together seems crazy. Probably a lot of people would think D. falconeri can hybridize with a Dionaea but, while morphologically similar, falco isn't any more closely related to Dionaea than any of the other petiolaris dews.

D. regia would be the best option. While it doesn't look anything like Dionaea, it is still the closest relative to it, so has the closest genetics. Here's a great chart for Drosera genetics on the ICPS-https://www.carnivorousplants.org/cp/ev ... aPhylogeny
Still, the hybrid would be very doubtful, and I can't even begin to imagine what regia x VFT would look like :lol:.

Just for the sake of it, I did try pollinating one of my regia flowers with some Low Giant x B52 pollen. I'll update if anything comes out of it, but I am very, very doubtful :lol:
I actually did seed about 2 months ago and got viable seed. Dissection showed an embryo. However none sprouted, so i assume they're incompatible with life.
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By Nepenthes0260
Posts:  1084
Joined:  Mon Apr 30, 2018 1:59 am
#378346
Matt wrote: Thu Apr 15, 2021 6:58 pm
Nepenthes0260 wrote:Just for the sake of it, I did try pollinating one of my regia flowers with some Low Giant x B52 pollen. I'll update if anything comes out of it, but I am very, very doubtful
Nepenthes0260 wrote:Oops, just re-read the article, looks like Low Giant x B52 is going to be the female parent and regia is going to be the pollen donor.
Cool, keep us posted!!
For sure, will do!
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By Nepenthes0260
Posts:  1084
Joined:  Mon Apr 30, 2018 1:59 am
#378347
hungrycarnivores wrote: Thu Apr 15, 2021 7:16 pm
Nepenthes0260 wrote: Thu Apr 15, 2021 6:45 pm Very interesting article, thanks for sharing!!

Firstly, those names are credible Drosera people. Sean Samia either has the largest or second largest Petiolaris Drosera collection in the states and Ivan Snyder is a Drosera fanatic as well, he's made some cool hybrids including 'Dr. Frankensnyder's Monster'.

I think trying to cross a Dionaea with a D. burmannii or brevifolia absolutely would not work. Not even all Drosera sp. are compatible (actually, most Drosera are not compatible), so thinking that plants like burmannii that have evolved far away from Dionaea can cross together seems crazy. Probably a lot of people would think D. falconeri can hybridize with a Dionaea but, while morphologically similar, falco isn't any more closely related to Dionaea than any of the other petiolaris dews.

D. regia would be the best option. While it doesn't look anything like Dionaea, it is still the closest relative to it, so has the closest genetics. Here's a great chart for Drosera genetics on the ICPS-https://www.carnivorousplants.org/cp/ev ... aPhylogeny
Still, the hybrid would be very doubtful, and I can't even begin to imagine what regia x VFT would look like :lol:.

Just for the sake of it, I did try pollinating one of my regia flowers with some Low Giant x B52 pollen. I'll update if anything comes out of it, but I am very, very doubtful :lol:
I actually did seed about 2 months ago and got viable seed. Dissection showed an embryo. However none sprouted, so i assume they're incompatible with life.
Regia x Dionaea? Or Dionaea x other Drosera
By hungrycarnivores
Posts:  105
Joined:  Mon Feb 22, 2021 9:53 pm
#378349
Nepenthes0260 wrote: Thu Apr 15, 2021 7:23 pm
hungrycarnivores wrote: Thu Apr 15, 2021 7:16 pm
Nepenthes0260 wrote: Thu Apr 15, 2021 6:45 pm Very interesting article, thanks for sharing!!

Firstly, those names are credible Drosera people. Sean Samia either has the largest or second largest Petiolaris Drosera collection in the states and Ivan Snyder is a Drosera fanatic as well, he's made some cool hybrids including 'Dr. Frankensnyder's Monster'.

I think trying to cross a Dionaea with a D. burmannii or brevifolia absolutely would not work. Not even all Drosera sp. are compatible (actually, most Drosera are not compatible), so thinking that plants like burmannii that have evolved far away from Dionaea can cross together seems crazy. Probably a lot of people would think D. falconeri can hybridize with a Dionaea but, while morphologically similar, falco isn't any more closely related to Dionaea than any of the other petiolaris dews.

D. regia would be the best option. While it doesn't look anything like Dionaea, it is still the closest relative to it, so has the closest genetics. Here's a great chart for Drosera genetics on the ICPS-https://www.carnivorousplants.org/cp/ev ... aPhylogeny
Still, the hybrid would be very doubtful, and I can't even begin to imagine what regia x VFT would look like :lol:.

Just for the sake of it, I did try pollinating one of my regia flowers with some Low Giant x B52 pollen. I'll update if anything comes out of it, but I am very, very doubtful :lol:
I actually did seed about 2 months ago and got viable seed. Dissection showed an embryo. However none sprouted, so i assume they're incompatible with life.
Regia x Dionaea? Or Dionaea x other Drosera
I actually did it both ways with regia and dionaea. I have more hopes in a cobra-sarr hybrid tbh. Dionaea flowers aren't receptive to that pollen .
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