FlytrapCare Carnivorous Plant Forums

I've been lurking a bit since getting into CP a year and a half ago. I got two pings that I was told they didn't need a winter rest and don't get succulent leaves. I started with them to see how I can grow butterworts. Well everyone was super happy so I got two more pings (among other plants- drosera, pitcher plants etc...) and they did well for a week or so so I ordered 4 more from another company. They did ok for a week or so then one started looking like this.





Then a week later another one started looking like this! (this was taken and has gotten worse in just a day!)





Now I'm scared that something is happening to them that might spread to the others. I'm wondering if I should move them away from the others, but I don't really have too much space. I would put them on a windowsill but then I'd get humidity issues.

As for growing, they're in a mix I bought from the place I bought my first bunch of CP. They're watered with store bought distilled water. I have them in a 20L fish tank with gravel and water in the bottom, then a shelving setup with the plants on them, then the lights above them. temps are about 64-69* and 60% humidity. Lights are on about 13-14 hours a day right now.

The place I got them from said to check for fungus gnat larvae which I see none but I do have gnats. They seem to be in the amaryllis and then fly over to the CP and get eaten there. They suggested watering from the bottom instead of the top and bottom like I have been.

I'm just not sure what to do. The first plant browning seems to have slowed down but went fairly fast to begin with, the second one is going pretty fast. The first feels dry no mushy, the second is slightly more mushy.

Please help! I'm not sure what to do?!!?

Hey there. I'm sorry you're having problems with your Mexican Pinguicula; do you know what species they are? The second one looks like the tag says P. laueana, which is a species that would benefit from the winter dry/winter rest - a gorgeous species, regardless. I hope it flowers for you in the spring, their flowers are the most amazing shade of red!

Thank you so much for being so detailed about your set up, it really helps us identify potential issues. Right off the top of my head, I would say the issue could be a combination of excess moisture and the changes in humidity. I've noticed that humidity can affect the leaves of Mexican pings (it's happened to me), usually this starts with a lack of mucus production but can cause some damage. Another thing to possibly consider is the lighting, depending on how close the plants are to it as this, combined with any moisture on the leaves, can lead to leaf scorching.

The plant in the first image looks like it might be a P. cycloseca (they have very distinctive leaves), which is another species that could do with a winter rest. It looks like it's already producing succulent leaves; the old, slightly lipped leaf with a purple tint is probably a carnivorous leaf that is dying off, could be due to age, but the damage on the other leaves surrounding it doesn't look like it's age related to me. The plant is quite dark in colour, which can happen during the winter dry period, but I am not entirely convinced that this is the reason. Dark green leaves can be a sign of lack of lighting, but if your other plants are looking all right then it might just need a bit of time to "come around", so to speak. Was it that shade of green when you received it? If you aren't sure about it, I would advise planting this particular plant separately to the others and watering it on its own as there is a disease known as browning heart disease that has dark, dull leaves as one of its symptoms, and this can spread to other Mexican pings through water trays. If you'd like to read more about BHD there is an article on this page about it, just scroll down and click on the "browning heart disease" heading. I can't see any other symptoms of BHD in the plant, but thought I'd let you know anyway just in case you spot something or there is a development.

To be honest, it may be that some the damage is being caused by transplant shock; these are very hardy plants, but if the environment they are now grown in is quite different to what they were previously used to, it's entirely possible that at least some of that damage is purely from shock. The nursery gave you great advice with regards to checking for fungus gnat larvae - these are common in pots of organic medium that is kept warm and moist for a long length of time, so allowing the soil your Mexican Pinguicula are kept in to dry out between waterings will be beneficial in preventing the larvae from thriving and thus damaging your plants.

What is the air flow like in the fish tank? A combination of elevated humidity, poor circulation (both in the air inside the fish tank and in the soil) and extra moisture could cause your plants to develop rot, as Mexican Pinguicula are, unfortunately, more prone to this than other carnivorous plants. It's important to keep them damp, but not wet, during the growing season and just damp during the winter dry, during which you can allow them to dry out for a week or two between each watering. The issues they are having may be compounded by the moisture they are exposed to, or could even be caused by the moisture. May I ask what your watering routine is like?

Mexican Pinguicula do not need elevated humidity to survive long term, so if you decide to take them out of the fish tank I don't think it'll do them any harm, the bigger issue with moving them around, if humidity is drastically different, is temporary shock, which I mentioned earlier.

I think that's all of the immediate questions/info for now, it's getting quite late here so I'm going to head to bed and then catch up with you tomorrow. I hope the information has been of some benefit, and that we can figure this out very soon.

You guessed right with both plants as to what they are. I bought these 4 specifically due to how beautiful they are! I was so excited to get them! One with beautiful red flowers, another with pink and white leaves (florian) one with red leaves and the last, my baby, with lilac leaves in good light! I was SOOOO excited! I'm trying to get them into their winter rest, but this happened first and quickly. Even my older one that I was told didn't do a winter succulent phase has smaller leaves this year, so I'm assuming it does in fact go into a rest. The other gina is still doing her thing, putting out new carnivorous leaves and is going nuts. The other newer ones I got are alfred lau #13 and moctezumae gigantea (I'm not sure that's spelled right) are the same still dewy and getting bugs. They've all been dry now, well not watered, for a week. Since they're new I wanted to stall the winter a couple weeks so they could get acclimated into my house. I was worried about shock.

In summer I water about 1-2 times a week, no water kept in their saucers. I only keep the sundews with water. They are in saucers not a tray, so there is no mixing of soil or water/drainage. Right now the sundews are getting water about the same as their saucers are drying out within 2-3 days (the capensis seems to not be happy a few of his leaves are dying but he has three new leaves over the last week and has a flower stalk. I was tempted to cut it to see if it'll help the plant but I read they really don't tax them much- should I cut it?- all the other sundews are super dewy and happy), but the pings are down to once a week or so, maybe slightly less now that this happened. I was really hoping this is what carnivorous leaves dying off as the succulent leaves come in looked like, but I soon realized that I think that's a wrong assumption. During the year when the lower leaves dye off they kind of wilt and disappear, these are crunchy. I'm very careful when I water to not get the leaves wet, I didn't know if it would cause rot or not so I just water from the sides of the plants. They did get wet leaves the first day when I potted them though. But I very carefully dried it off with a paper towel, just holding it on the leaf and letting it absorb the water, not wiping or anything. They told me to start watering them from below to see if that helps.

My second thought on this was maybe they were too close to the light after being shipped and maybe got burned? The laueana looked super at first, it was a nice green then after a week or so got nice reddish tinges on it's leaves, so I assumed it was super happy with the light etc... But now it seems to be sulking and getting worse. The browning that was wilty yesterday is getting crusty today, so it's not like it's rotting, it's like it's dying. Which is why I watered them again last week, thinking they were too dry.

The tank is open at the top and with the heat/ac there is slight movement, but not like a small fan would do.

Here are some more photos

the tank between the two shipments of pings, after I got the last four I added another shelf extension and a third light.



Here is the cycloseca the day I got her


and the lauteana the day I got him


and then once he started looking really healthy with red tinges

Thanks for your thorough reply! The plants look like they may have been light deprived when you received them, to be honest, because they are very dark shades of green and the leaves don't look quite right to me, even when in succulent mode (they were rather floppy). The laueana looks fantastic in the second image, so that's really encouraging and says that your set up is definitely benefiting them. Your watering routine also sounds great, which is a big bonus. How are the other Mexican pings looking and how do these two look today?

May I ask where abouts in the world you're from? I'm just trying to think about climate and shipping, but as the issues came about after shipping I don't believe this to be the case, worth exploring anyway.

Also, what size are the plants? Something I'll throw out there - but can't say whether or not these plants fall into that circumstance - is that, occasionally, when a Mexican Pinguicula divides, the new division can look quite dark green and a little on the floppy side. Sometimes this doesn't actually pass for a good long while, other times it passes quickly once the plant is divided. I have had a couple of small divisions that maintain their dark green appearance before dying very suddenly. I don't really think the P. cyclosecta in particular falls into that category (I definitely don't think that's the case with the laueana), but thought I would mention it anyway.

Regarding the sundews, the only species I've kept are D. capensis, D. dielsiana and .D. scorpioides so I don't too much experience. Capensis plants are incredibly hardy and seen as weeds of the carnivorous plant world; they should ideally be moist all the time and not allowed to dry out as they are sub tropical. Some leaf die-off is normal, but some photos would probably help. I'm happy to do what I can to help with it in this topic, alternatively please feel free to start a new one specifically for your sundews in the sundew sub-forum, where much more experienced members can help a lot more.

Thanks so much for helping with this and trying to figure out what's wrong and what I can do I really appreciate it!!

I live in the north-east part of the US zone 5b.

Here are what they look like today, I just took a quick snap to put up here so the metering is off and they might look dark/light.

The only one they said was shortly out of tissue was the florian. I'm not 100% what that means since he said it's not young and the care will be just like normal. I'm not sure the age of the others. I was a bit worried that they shipped bare-root since the others all came in a pot and in real good shape. They seemed a bit floppy when I got some of them, but for the most part after potting and watering they seemed to perk up a bit. The laueana really looked good for a bit, the nursery saw that one photo when I sent the one of the cyclosecta and he was very impressed. So I'm not sure why it went down hill from there. I think I got these guys on the 18th of nov or so. The cyclosecta photo was taken on the 11th and it had started getting brown a week before that, but only a leaf or two so I thought maybe it was just in shock and kept an eye on it. So far, knock on wood what it looks like in this photo has been stable for a few days now and hasn't spread to any more leaves. But the laueana is spreading a bit.

I'll put the pitchers and sundews here too. I'll try to post the sundew issue in the other area in a bit. I also have 3 nepenthes and a flytrap and Am pitcher (the last two in the basement in dormancy)



a slightly closer look, I don't see any browning in the middle


laueana this photo is pretty dark it doesn't look this drab


gina


gigantea


alfred lau #13


the aphrodite which looks a lot smaller then it did this summer, so I'm assuming this is it's winter mode


florian (which didn't photograph well, it's not this light)


agnata


closer look


my first gina leaf pulling (can't remember how old, maybe 4 months?)


the capensis that seems to be dying- but he did give me 2-3 new leaves over the weekend and has an impressive flower stem with lots of flowers.


and the other sundews that all seem happy






and look a baby pitcher!!!


and the tank as it looks right now


And yes that's just aluminum foil, I will be trying to get something a bit better back there. I will also be buying mosquito dunks for the water in the bottom of the tank. Right now it's distilled water since I don't know if it's ok to have other water evaporating in there for the humidity. I also think it might be easier to keep cleaner that way. The humidity in the house today is in the low 30's so the tank really does help with that! Which is why I'm scared to move these two to a window that's too much of a shock I think. I could get a small critter keeper or something for them though, I have the flytrap and the small Am pitcher plant in one in the basement to keep the humidity up a bit down there. Of course the flytrap doesn't seem too happy, but he's getting light unlike last year which the only place I had for him was a cold dark closet. I hope being int he basement near a window will help him grow more this year. He'll also be living outside too if the weather will be ok, he's normally in the tank with these other guys and seems fine, just not getting any bigger. But he was a rescue who was most likely doomed from the start.

With the mosquito dunks I plan on putting it in my rain water that I use for my house plants and orchids to try to get rid of any larvae that might be around (and this will be the LAST year I buy those freakin' amaryllis! Ever year no matter where I buy them, or the soil from they bring these darn bugs into my house) I know the dunks are safe for the house plants but what about the CPs? I was planning on putting a bit into the tank water, but should I also water the plants with it too?

You are most welcome! Happy to help however I can, I hope we can figure this out sooner rather than later for you, though. I'm not entirely sure what the issue is right now but we'll get there. Also, when the nursery mentioned a plant coming out of tissue, he probably meant tissue culture, which is a highly sterile, fast process of propagating plants.

It's only the newest two that are showing the symptoms, isn't it? Very strange, but the others look absolutely lovely (including the laueana, despite the damage), so you're definitely keeping them right! It does sound like it could be that the cyclosecta is taking a bit of a beating with adjusting to your growing conditions, particularly if it has stabilized since you posted the photos. I honestly am thinking it could be humidity related as I have seen this happen in other, more sensitive warm temperate Pinguicula before - the leaf damage is very similar. If the two were sent bare root, this could contribute to their condition but shouldn't be a problem, really. The vivid, dark green colour is what is flagging up most for me as that is very unusual for a P. cyclosecta so I think there is more than just a humidity adjustment problem going on.

It might be worth repotting the P. cyclosecta in fresh medium and removing the old leaves, which will give you a good opportunity to check the roots of the plant and make sure they are white with no damage. It might be that there is something in this particular pot that the plant is struggling with, such as some form of pest. I don't believe it's the potting mix you're using as the other plants are looking great, so maybe something has gotten into that particular container and is causing some damage.

I've kept all of my Mexican pings on a windowsill for a few years without any problems with humidity, so if you feel in future, once the two having issues are stable and have recovered sufficiently, that you would like to move them to a windowsill I don't see that being an issue. Of course, the change in humidity would likely leave the plants thirsting a little more for water (though these can go months without) and may stop them producing mucus for a few weeks, but otherwise it should be fine.

RE: mosquito dunks, I think they'll be fine in the water in the bottom of the aquarium but I'm not sure about using them with the actual water for the plants themselves. There are members on the forums who have done it, so maybe a search in that regard would be useful to you. I don't believe you'll need to water the plants with it, but again I don't have any experience I'm afraid to say so am not able to help out too much with that. Hopefully some answers will come up for you though!

I'll do a bit more digging tomorrow and see if I can find any similar cases to yours.

Thanks hopefully we can figure this out.

Yes the 4 latest were the florian, agnata red leaf, laueana and the cycloescta, all bare-root. And yes he said it was fairly new out of tissue and if I wanted an older one I could wait, but they sell out so fast I wanted to make sure I got one. He seems to be fine. They all came kind of dry and wilted, they came across the country and the moss seemed a bit dry when it got here. I potted them up and watered them in good and everything seemed ok. It is only the two of the four that have this. Which is what worried me a bit since whatever this is isn't affecting any of the other plants from the other nursery.

So do you think the lower humidity here is drying out the leaves? I'll repot the cyclosecta tomorrow and see how he does. I have been bugging it a bit to keep on an eye on the roots. They are a bit browner looking today. I'm worried it was too wet and is rotting. I hope drying out will help. I put some dry mix on top of the mix two days ago to see if it helps to dry him out quicker.

yeah the laueana looks ok, but everywhere that the leaves got that lovely reddish tinge is now softening. It's also lost all it's mucus too since the other day.

Your capensis seems fine. Sundew usually slows down their growth when flowering for me unless you keep feeding them. I don't recommend that you cut away the flower stalk since it is too late. Flowers should be cut off when it is around 1-3 cm. It would be better for it to flower and you will be rewarded with tons of seeds for the next growing season . I can see little sprouts at the base of your capensis, it should grow huge in no time!

Also, what kind of light are you using? What is the color temperature?

It could be an increase or decrease in humidity causing some of the issues, but I really don't think that's the only issue for the cyclosecta in particular. I'm not sure what the relative humidity in my room is, but in the winter it can get very low - these are highly adaptable plants and I would say that 60% humidity would not be too low by any means, in fact that's probably really good and lower humidity would likely be fine as well; it's simply the adjustment period that can cause the leaf symptoms, which should subside naturally after a little time. Rot could definitely be another factor, so allowing the soil to dry out a bit would definitely be beneficial, especially if the roots aren't looking great.

TS thanks, I think I remember the capensis doing this the last time it flowered, just not quite to this extreme. It does have new growth that's why I wasn't too worried. But everyone says they grow like mad and mine is the same as it was when I bought it so I worried a bit.

the lights I use are LED lights I got for growing orchids. I'm not sure of the technical stuff. Here's what the website says. "These are 13W bulbs containing 64 LED chips, in a combination of cool white, warm white, and red, resulting in a color temperature in the range of 5700-6400°K, like a bright day outdoors, with enhanced red wavelengths for better flowering and color rendition than is found in other brands. These have an initial output of about 1200 lumens, and have been measured as having a Photosynthetic Photon Flux Density (PPFD) of 45 µmol/m2/sec at a distance of one foot from the lamp when driven at 11W, 55 µmol/m2/sec @ 13W. As a point of reference, a 2-foot, 24W T5HO lamp puts out about 60 µmol/m2/sec at that distance. Phalaenopsis do very well at 30 µmol/m2/sec for 12-14 hours per day."

All my orchids love them, I don't have high light stuff since I am not sure they're quite bright enough for that unless I get another fixture or two to put them in to add light (with the CP I have the clamp lights you see in the photo, for the orchids I have them on wire shelving and use incandescent fish tank light strips for each shelf. So far the CPs seem to like them, no one was sure how well any of them would do when I said I use them but all the plants have a reddish tinge which I was told was a sign they're getting enough light. I did put up the aluminum foil and will get mylar or something soon for the pitcher plant since I think he might want more light, but I did put him smack dab in the middle right under a light in the hopes it'll be enough.

I was going to put the CP in my east window with the lights for extra light in the pm but everything gets burned in there! I stuck my temp/humidity gauge in there one day at it read 118*! Not good for CPs pings especially. So in a fit of despair at having this great window I bought succulents and cactus who all seem to love it so far! Something new to grow!

You've two lighting, so it would sum up to 2400 lumens. Most drosera do OK at 1500 lumens. Flytraps and Sarracenia prefer 2500 lumens. But you have to count for the light loss because it seems a little bit too far. Why not get a T5-HO for your tank?

I originally got them for the orchids since the LEDs are cheap to run. I had 2 extra so I used them with the CPs and they seemed to do well. Last month when I got the extra pings I had to increase the tank from a 10 to a 20L so I added the third light. I haven't done any light readings as I don't have a meter for LEDs, I haven't tried the camera trick yet as I hear the LEDs don't read right on them or some of the cheaper meters. I've kept the flytrap under them for two years and he is doing just ok, but this year I plan on keeping him outside. All the sarracenia will be outside. So far I only have two, overwintered two last year and lost one due to the temps being severely cold for very long periods. the native one I got overwintered just fine. I plan on buying a bunch more since our new house has a spring runoff area that is boggy! Can't wait to clear it out a bit! I plan on keeping the "daintier" ones in containers and then overwinter in the basement with the flytraps.

When we moved the smaller tank went from some dappled sun in a window to just under lights now. I'm going to be keeping an eye on them to see if I need to move the drosera closer to the lights but so far so good. Again it's only been like 4 months so with lower winter light it's hard to tell. Summer they might need more. I will be adding the mylar though to help with side light etc...

Here is the cyclosecta repotted today and her roots. The soil I had left here was a higher sand ratio it seems, it must have settled to the bottom of the bag. I assume that's ok right?







and look what I found under her, a baby! I put it in the pot with the other two leaf pullings I have, hopefully whatever she has won't spread. Maybe I should move it to the pot with the parent?? (the larger one on the left is the gina leaf) I did just water the babies that's why the soil is wet.



Here is her color compared to the other plants.



and here is the laueana today, should I repot him too?



and look! the agnata red leaf is already getting leaves!!!!

gardengirl13 wrote:I was going to put the CP in my east window with the lights for extra light in the pm but everything gets burned in there! I stuck my temp/humidity gauge in there one day at it read 118*! Not good for CPs pings especially. So in a fit of despair at having this great window I bought succulents and cactus who all seem to love it so far! Something new to grow!

Ouch! Mexican Pinguicula are sometimes considered to be succulent carnivorous plants, and can handle temperatures up to 104*F as long as night time temps are cool but 118 is definitely pushing it! I think any excuse for more plants in a greater diversity is a good excuse though. Hehe.

A higher sand ratio for Mexican pings is actually preferable because of their increased risk of rot, so that is no problem at all. The cyclosecta is a good size and while some of the roots do look OK the others are a bit brown, so it seems like rot may have been setting in, I can also see some dark discolouration at the base of the plants, so now that you've repotted it I'm sure it'll do better as long as you keep it damp and let it dry out a bit in-between waterings. The dark green colouring of the leaves may hang around for a little while but should develop into lighter hues as the plant recovers. Always a bonus finding a baby plant, too!

The laueana actually looks OK despite the leaf damage but it might be worth checking the roots just to be safe; if they are a bit squishy, repotting is an option but not a necessity. You may find reducing the amount of water you give to this plant resolves any rot as it isn't in the same condition as the cyclosecta.

Congratulations on the agnata strike, too! They're so much fun. My P. 'Tina' pullings have actually grown more over the last month than during the entire summer - we've had an extremely mild winter so far, even for us in the UK, and my plants are soaking it all in.

Yeah, heat stress could definitely be a problem if it's continuous. Basically all CP's will sustain some damage at temps as high as 118F.

However, the plants that will suffer most from heat are not the pings, but your H. heterodoxa x minor and D. graomogolensis. Both of these are highland tepui-dwelling plants that need consistently cool temps to survive long-term. A safe bet would be something like 70-80F day and low 60s at night. Given, these are both among the most tolerant of Heliamphora and South American Drosera, respectively, but high temps can still do severe damage to them.