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By Benny
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Posts:  452
Joined:  Thu Jan 16, 2020 9:46 pm
#353393
Copper2 wrote: Tue May 05, 2020 8:00 pm You guys are also forgetting something. As flytraps are monocarpic bulbs the mother plant actually die after flowering and an offset is produced from the base of the mother bulb which is the “division” that replaces the mother plant. So this idea that the mother plant lives a long time is foolhardy so it’s not surprising that as Jagasian’s plant divides and the mother plant dies
Plus, Jagasian's plant wouldn't have flowered, due to the lack of seasons.
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By Artchic528
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Joined:  Sat Aug 15, 2015 8:13 pm
#353394
True. If the plant were kept in static conditions, there would be no way to trigger it to flower. I'm under the impression that his plant is exposed to minor changes in lighting throuought the year, enough to trigger a minor and brief dormancy period just long enough to keep the plant alive and dividing, but not enough to trigger flowering.

I've studied the picture Jagasian provided of their plant and the petioles look rather wavvy, a sure sign of something in it's environment/care not being adiquate. Usually this indicates that it's substrate may not be suitable, either from being too waterlogged, or not being repotted in fresh substrate frequently enough. At least that's from my own experience.
By Copper2
Posts:  915
Joined:  Fri Jan 25, 2019 7:02 am
#353415
You people are clearly blind. Have you really not noticed that the mother division does not produce any more traps after flowering? Sure the plant doesn’t wilt and die but it produces no new growth. Instead a new division replaces it
By Benny
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#353416
Uhh, mine is still producing new growth.
Not sure what you are talking about. I cut mine off at 2 inches, and it is acting like any other flytrap.
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By Benny
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Posts:  452
Joined:  Thu Jan 16, 2020 9:46 pm
#353417
Artchic528 wrote: Tue May 05, 2020 9:33 pm True. If the plant were kept in static conditions, there would be no way to trigger it to flower. I'm under the impression that his plant is exposed to minor changes in lighting throuought the year, enough to trigger a minor and brief dormancy period just long enough to keep the plant alive and dividing, but not enough to trigger flowering.

I've studied the picture Jagasian provided of their plant and the petioles look rather wavvy, a sure sign of something in it's environment/care not being adiquate. Usually this indicates that it's substrate may not be suitable, either from being too waterlogged, or not being repotted in fresh substrate frequently enough. At least that's from my own experience.
He said he has 6 other pots with divisions, so he has repotted recently. It must be some other declination in health, I would agree though, the leaves are strangely wavy.
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By _-SphagnumFromHell-_
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Joined:  Mon May 28, 2018 5:02 pm
#353421
Copper2 wrote:You people are clearly blind. Have you really not noticed that the mother division does not produce any more traps after flowering? Sure the plant doesn’t wilt and die but it produces no new growth. Instead a new division replaces it
No, I very clearly recall my plants continuing on after flowering. The biggest clone of my Maroon Monster is still intact after flowering.
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By Copper2
Posts:  915
Joined:  Fri Jan 25, 2019 7:02 am
#353422
https://www.jstor.org/stable/2471155?re ... b_contents

The main meristem does terminate after flowering. An axillary bud replaces it which either makes a new division if the dormant bud is lower down or it looks like it’s growing from the same growth point if it’s a bud from a more recent leaf. It does make the change like I said though
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By salty
Posts:  195
Joined:  Mon May 17, 2010 11:30 am
#353436
I can only read the abstract and not going to pay $20 for an article from 1929 that may or may not say it’s monocarpic. When I get bored I’ll try and dig myself. Thanks
By Copper2
Posts:  915
Joined:  Fri Jan 25, 2019 7:02 am
#353437
Ever tried signing up and get the 100 free articles currently available? No special institute needed
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By Artchic528
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Posts:  612
Joined:  Sat Aug 15, 2015 8:13 pm
#353455
Copper2 wrote:https://www.jstor.org/stable/2471155?re ... b_contents

The main meristem does terminate after flowering. An axillary bud replaces it which either makes a new division if the dormant bud is lower down or it looks like it’s growing from the same growth point if it’s a bud from a more recent leaf. It does make the change like I said though
Your link requires being a member of an institution to read. I am not able to see it. Maybe try providing a link to something where you aren't required to sign up to a site to read it. I'm just going to resume knowing that a Venus flytrap mother plant resumes living and such after flowering.

Sent from my SM-N920V using Tapatalk
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By Artchic528
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Joined:  Sat Aug 15, 2015 8:13 pm
#353457
Copper2 wrote: Wed May 06, 2020 11:11 am Ever tried signing up and get the 100 free articles currently available? No special institute needed
I'm wary of anything that says I need to sign up to read it. Especially when said article is from nearly 100 years ago. Like I said, provide a link to an article that doesn't require signing up to anywhere to read and perhaps an article more recently published. A lot has changed and been discovered in the past 100 or so years since that article was written.
Last edited by Artchic528 on Wed May 06, 2020 6:35 pm, edited 1 time in total.
By Copper2
Posts:  915
Joined:  Fri Jan 25, 2019 7:02 am
#353462
Facts are built upon not changed. With your point of view you might as well be saying that the world is flat since the last study was ages ago and NASA is a secret hoax society.

Give me a break. You people have the dadgum plants. Instead of just insisting what you think you saw why don’t you go take a close look at it? You’ll notice the growth point is growing in a slightly different direction than when it flowered. That’s the axillary bud that’s taken over which is pretty much a division that hasn’t separated.

And you did sign up to read and post on this forum. So do you not believe anything you read on here? You can sign up without an institute and without paying to see that article I sent. You just give up I see without even trying
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By Artchic528
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Joined:  Sat Aug 15, 2015 8:13 pm
#353463
Copper2 wrote:Facts are built upon not changed. With your point of view you might as well be saying that the world is flat since the last study was ages ago and NASA is a secret hoax society.
This is actually proving my point and contradictory to yours. :lol:

At one point, everyone thought it fact that the world was flat and that sailing beyond that of the known world would result in falling off of it into a void. How could that possibly have been "built upon"? It was not "built upon" but changed when ships began sailing from the then known world to parts unknown and discovering that they wouldn't fall into some void, but keep on sailing until they came around to the other side of the known world, or at least make landfall upon lands yet unknown to them.

Regardless, how are we still discussing this when this thread is supposed to be about dormancy?
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By Copper2
Posts:  915
Joined:  Fri Jan 25, 2019 7:02 am
#353468
Thinking something as a fact is different than a fact. A fact is scientifically recorded and is not an opinion. The information they had back then along with their beliefs pointed to a flat earth but new facts combined with the old facts made people realize the earth was round. When someone sailed around the world it became a proven fact
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By Matt
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Joined:  Mon Apr 21, 2008 11:28 pm
#353470
Artchic528 wrote: Wed May 06, 2020 6:45 pm
Copper2 wrote:Facts are built upon not changed. With your point of view you might as well be saying that the world is flat since the last study was ages ago and NASA is a secret hoax society.
This is actually proving my point and contradictory to yours. :lol:
:lol: I thought the same thing! At one point in the history of the world, it was a "fact" that the world is flat. So are we still building upon that "fact" or have we since learned otherwise? :D

The main point of this thread was that Venus flytraps don't need dormancy, which stimulated a robust conversation and I think we all learned something, which is the main reason we are all here on these forums interacting with each other, right?! Yay for learning!!

As for the latest discussion, about the meristem terminating after flowering, I'm not exactly sure what is being referred to as the "meristem" in Venus flytraps, but I'm guessing it is the primary growth point or the "crown" of the Venus flytrap? If not, can someone please clarify what you're referring to as the "meristem" because that's not a term I'm overly familiar with as I've been out of college for over 20 years now and only took a couple of biology courses in college!

If we are referring to the crown of a Venus flytrap as its meristem, it has not been my experience that the primary growth point dies. In fact, some years for some Venus flytrap cultivars that I grow in large pots (I call them mother pots), the large plants flower to set seed and don't even divide at all, let alone die.
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