FlytrapCare Carnivorous Plant Forums

sanguinearocks101 wrote:Frankly, if a person new to CPs buys one of my harder to grow plants, that’s their decision

Agreed. But it is kind of a pain when the plant dies and the customer files a chargeback case with PayPal and PayPal upholds it. Then you're out the plant and the funds. This has happened to us many times over the years of running FlytrapStore. We've probably lost over $2000 in funds due to situations like this in the 11 years we've been operating. Thus, we try to stick to selling the easier to grow plants.

People will buy cheaper plants on Etsy all the time; even some uncommon aroids like P. Florida Ghost or Melanochrysum($100+). Couldn't say definitively what would move or not. I've used Etsy as a last resource before. I've purchased Byblis seeds from Etsy as well. I think niche plants and "gateway" plants like flytraps would do very well. Only "cultivars" are some busted-looking seed grown and Akai Ryu. If you were to put fused tooth on there for instance, I'm sure it would sell fine. If it doesn't cost much to list the item, it couldn't hurt to throw it up and see what happens with it. If you have the only Nepenthes on there, every single person looking for a Nepenthes is going to see it. Someone may buy it. I could see N. Veitchii selling on Etsy because of the unique look and color of them.

That said, I wouldn't put up a Black Miracle or a Macrophylla. The plants over 200 dollars probably would sit there because it won't likely be used by real enthusiasts. I wouldn't shut down the channel entirely though. I think I may put some pinguicula on there and see what happens. They're about 15-20 dollar plants and really fit into the scene for your typical Etsy shopper. They have an aesthetic that women often love too. Of all the CPs I've shown to a regular person, pinguiculas always get the most attention. I'm sure Pirouette would sell on Etsy just by adding the keyword "Succulent."

Matt wrote: ↑Sat Nov 21, 2020 7:10 pm

sanguinearocks101 wrote:Frankly, if a person new to CPs buys one of my harder to grow plants, that’s their decision

Agreed. But it is kind of a pain when the plant dies and the customer files a chargeback case with PayPal and PayPal upholds it. Then you're out the plant and the funds. This has happened to us many times over the years of running FlytrapStore. We've probably lost over $2000 in funds due to situations like this in the 11 years we've been operating. Thus, we try to stick to selling the easier to grow plants.

Do you know of any ways to avoid them getting a refund from a chargeback case?

sanguinearocks101 wrote:Do you know of any ways to avoid them getting a refund from a chargeback case?

Don't use PayPal. They truly suck and almost always bow to the purchaser rather than the seller. We've got a squeaky clean track record that goes back 11 years too. We run a very honest business and are always willing to work with people through any complaints to get it resolved. It is rare to have it go to a chargeback unless the person is just out to scam, which seems to happen to us at least 1-2 times a year. Someone will buy something, we'll send it, USPS shows it was delivered, then the person files a chargeback either saying "Product not as described" or "I did not place this order" but they refuse to send the plant back, never responding to emails or phone calls. PayPal grants them a refund and not only are we out the money for the plant, labor, and shipping, but PayPal also charges the seller with a $25 penalty (I think it's $25?) in addition due to having someone file a chargeback. WTF?!! Makes me so angry but there's not much we can do as there aren't many other good payment processing options for small vendors.

Wow, they actually charge you too? That actually has a me a little nervous because I've been using Paypal and Venmo. I know a couple of people will be alright but it's the ones who come out with no previous posts etc. that have me wondering. I'm hoping to get something started on my own as well and it sounds like I'll be needing to find a different outlet. It's one thing to get ripped off, but to pay for the express pleasure of being ripped off? No Thanks.

Your experience was very insightful, thank you for that. As I mentioned earlier, I've personally heard some terrible stories about eBay buyers. I guess it'd stand to reason Paypal would be similar in policy considering it was the main platform for eBay transactions from the beginning. Though I wonder, does sending "Friends and Family" keep them from being able to do that? That's what I've been doing, due to the tax. It wouldn't be a transaction for a product, at least not on paper.

Matt wrote: ↑Sat Nov 21, 2020 5:29 pm

jose wrote:Etsy = avoid at all costs IMHO

I can't understand your rationale for this. Etsy is a very good place to sell in our experience.

Just my opinion

Apollyon wrote:Wow, they actually charge you too? That actually has a me a little nervous because I've been using Paypal and Venmo. I know a couple of people will be alright but it's the ones who come out with no previous posts etc. that have me wondering. I'm hoping to get something started on my own as well and it sounds like I'll be needing to find a different outlet. It's one thing to get ripped off, but to pay for the express pleasure of being ripped off? No Thanks.

Yeah, be careful who you sell to. We keep a list of people who have ripped us off in the past. We also are very cautious about sending large orders (more than 2 plants) to people we've never seen order from us before. If using PayPal as your payment processor, it certainly "pays" to be cautious!

What really baffles me is why people have to be such shady characters in the first place. Hard to believe that people would scam someone out of a freaking plant, but I guess it is the world we're living in these days.

Apollyon wrote:Your experience was very insightful, thank you for that. As I mentioned earlier, I've personally heard some terrible stories about eBay buyers. I guess it'd stand to reason Paypal would be similar in policy considering it was the main platform for eBay transactions from the beginning.

Yes, there's a reason we try to avoid selling on eBay. Sometimes, if product isn't moving fast enough on our website or if business is just really slow and we need to generate more revenue, I'll list things on eBay for sale. But the eBay buyers, as a whole, are the worst we've ever dealt with. Lots of scamming, both on the side of sellers and buyers, goes down on eBay.

Apollyon wrote:Though I wonder, does sending "Friends and Family" keep them from being able to do that? That's what I've been doing, due to the tax. It wouldn't be a transaction for a product, at least not on paper.

I think you are correct. The "Friends and Family" option provides the seller with much more protection and I don't believe it is possible to file a chargeback in that case. However, when selling through any eCommerce software that allows the customer to use credit cards, the "Friends and Family" option isn't available.

jose wrote:Just my opinion

OK...well....not much to say in response to that. Everyone is entitled to their opinion. I was just wondering if you had any solid talking points to support your opinion because my opinion is quite different from yours and, after selling on Etsy for a couple of years, I can list clear reasons why Etsy is a good place to sell from my experience.

As a seller and buyer on ebay, the one tip is you should know is to sell with the intention of losing your item to a scam. If you can't stomach that loss, then Ebay is not a good choice and you'd be better off with selling locally with cash.

Ebay caters to large sellers that can eat a scam here and there as a cost of doing business, and caters really heavily to buyers. If someone really wanted to scam you, there is nothing at all you can do to stop it. The "no refunds" button does nothing at all once the ebay dispute starts, it's more of a barrier that honest buyers would follow. All a scammer has to do is request a refund and send you back a rock, or take a picture saying they received some other plant.

After all, Ebay can only confirm that you shipped something but they can't confirm you shipped the actual item even if you took pictures or video. Ebay cannot confirm that after the video, the seller didn't re-open the box and swap out the plant. So Ebay has to pick a side.

Stories of sellers winning disputes exists but it's not common.

@Z_Y, that's an excellent summary of selling on eBay and pretty much details our experience selling there, which is why we no longer do sell there.

Not gonna lie. Between my mother's stories and yours, I don't think I'll be doing it either. Plants take much too long to just give away to someone enhancing their collection on the cheap. Ebay needs an overhaul though, seriously. The thing that truly bothers me is how they will withdraw money from your account whether you like it or not. They shouldn't have that kind of control. It should be up to the seller to approve that or be banned. I mean do they do that with items in the thousands? Just take some scammers word at face value? Another one of my personal favorites is the buyer's ability to have the last word on responses to feedback :/

But true, if I was turning out as many VFTs as CCCP I probably would be annoyed but it wouldn't break the bank if someone decided to rip me off. Holding feedback hostage is pretty dirty as well. Thats why I don't mind buying from someone whos less than 100%. Probably either got burned or refused to budge on getting ripped off a return. I've had a 97% send me three plants becasuse the growth points kept snapping in transit from rough covid handling back in April. I genuinely felt bad about it lol, I didn't ask but the point is some of those lower feedback people are genuinely good sellers. Something to keep in mind if you guys only deal with 100s.

Think for me it'd be the forum, facebook marketplace/cp groups, and eventually my own website provided I can keep up. That 25 dollar paypal dispute charge you talked about has me checking it every day Matt lol.