BLACK Sarracenia!

Discuss Sarracenia, Heliamphora, Darlingtonia, Cephalotus plant care here
User Avatar
meizzwang

 
Posts: 145
Joined: Tue Dec 06, 2011 12:56 am
Thanked: 177 times in 75 posts

BLACK Sarracenia!

by meizzwang » Thu Jan 10, 2019 6:59 pm

Black Sarracenia have been in the cross hairs of breeders for a long time now, but few have succeeded in creating such a beast. Granted, there are a few Sarracenia out there that do turn black with an "artificial suntan" aka when greenhouse grown, but has anyone made a plant that turns black from head to toe without the need of a greenhouse?

It's definitely not easy to make such a plant, the reason being that most of the black clones/genetics in cultivation are difficult to coax that color out of them. They really need the exact right conditions to darken up! Sure, they will get black when grown under powerful lights indoors or under greenhouse conditions, but outdoors, they merely get dark. Here's a good example of a black alata that gets dark under my outdoor conditions, but not black. This is S. alata dark 'upward lid' Stone Co, MS:
Image


In the wild, they definitely can get pretty dark as the traps age, but you don't see such a high frequency of dark alatas in cultivation. As an aside, I've bred with many "proven" black alata clones only to find the offpsring are generally not as impressive. Some selfed plants (ie. selfed alata 'Night') looked quite impressive greenhouse grown, but they still don't color up easily outdoors. Anyways, the pics below are from wild plants growing in Stone Co, MS:
Image


Image



Previously, the closest thing I've personally grown that gets really dark without a greenhouse suntan is Phil's Faulisi's Black Widow:
Image

Honorable mention shout out to Rob Sacilotto's S. 'Tornado'(aka S. 'Vortex') There are also pictures online of some black flava x alata crosses made by insektenfang.com, but since the pictures are clearly copyrighted, I'm not going to copy them in this thread. That hybrid appears to have a very black head, but the body is dark red. I'm very confident these were greenhouse grown plants, and they appear to be as dark as some of the black alatas grown under greenhouse conditions.

For those of us without greenhouses, are there any individual plants out there that turn black even under outdoor conditions? I'm not aware of any non-man made plants like that.

Logically, there has to be a way to make a completely black plant from head to toe using flava rubricorpora and the dark alatas, so that's what I did. Black widow is really cool, but I want blacker! LOL

I made several small batch crosses with many different clones in search of that black individual. By small batch, I mean I sowed between 30-50 or so seeds per batch. Surprisingly, most were duds: while the plants were pretty and many were bright red, none were black, so I tossed every last cross out. In one cross, I did get a few darker indivduals, but not darker than black widow. GAH!!!! Phil either got lucky or did a lot of pheno hunting to find black widow. Anyways, Next thought was, what if I grew out over a 1000 seeds, will that one black individual appear? Those black genes have to be there somewhere, maybe it's just a numbers game. But it's not practical to grow out 1000 of each cross, that could take up a lot of space very quickly and become impractical.

I decided to focus on one cross that had dark individuals and re-made it the following year, producing an enormous seed batch. If a few dark ones showed up in 50 seeds or less, will that one black one show up in 1000?

It was a ridiculous amount of work transplanting seedlings and culling lighter colored individuals. No, I didn't grow them all the way out (don't have space and time for that), I did massive cullings and selected out the darkest ones.


With a combination of an educated guess and the power of numbers, I finally found that one individual that I was looking for! Interestingly, NOT A SINGLE OTHER PLANT in the super sized seedling batch was as dark as this individual! There were some that I suspect could probably get blacker with an artificial suntan, but I was looking for the one that gets black under multiple environmental conditions. There were other individuals that came close in terms of blackness, but I culled them to make sure imposters don't go into circulation. Speaking of imposters, this is the reason that I'm not giving out exact details about the clones used in this cross, but in general, flava rubricorpora and alata were used, just like in Phil's black widow cross.

Perhaps the beans are being spilled quite early as this plant is still a seedling, but after you see the pics below, you'll probably agree that this individual is already outstanding. In case you haven't already read this thread about seedling selection and want to dig deeper, I recommend reading this: http://sarracenia.proboards.com/thread/ ... -selection

This un-named clone below doesn't start off black: the traps really have to age before it gets to this color. This plant was naturally grown outdoors in Northern California, and quite possibly represents one of the first of its kind that can get black from head to toe without an artificial greenhouse suntan:

Image

In case you want to zoom in to see the details of the pic above: https://www.flickr.com/photos/63000221@ ... ateposted/

Image

and if you want to zoom in: https://www.flickr.com/photos/63000221@ ... otostream/

The whole dang thing is black:
Image

Another shot: notice some of the younger, smaller traps still have some greenish pigments on the lid:
Image


Image

In case you want a close up of that last pic: https://www.flickr.com/photos/63000221@ ... otostream/

This is still a seedling, so again, I may be spilling the beans a bit early about it. For this reason, it won't be named or go into circulation until it reaches vegetative maturity and has been throughly "explored." Who knows, something better might turn up in the meantime. To be continued....

The following users would like to thank meizzwang for this post
Copper2, hollyhock, KategoricalKarnivore, Matt, nimbulan, PitcherPerfect

User Avatar
nimbulan

 
Posts: 1994
Joined: Fri Feb 28, 2014 9:03 pm
Location: Oregon
Thanked: 474 times in 413 posts

Re: BLACK Sarracenia!

by nimbulan » Thu Jan 10, 2019 8:53 pm

Looks like a winner to me.

The following users would like to thank nimbulan for this post
meizzwang

User Avatar
KategoricalKarnivore

 
Posts: 1725
Joined: Wed Aug 24, 2016 6:00 pm
Location: Beaumont Texas
Thanked: 692 times in 489 posts

Re: BLACK Sarracenia!

by KategoricalKarnivore » Thu Jan 10, 2019 10:22 pm

That is impressive for sure. Thanks for sharing Mike.
A garden to walk in and immensity to dream in--what more could he ask? A few flowers at his feet and above him the stars.
Victor Hugo, Les Misérables

User Avatar
SundewWolf

 
Posts: 2103
Joined: Fri Mar 08, 2013 2:38 pm
Thanked: 343 times in 311 posts

Re: BLACK Sarracenia!

by SundewWolf » Thu Jan 10, 2019 10:42 pm

I've been passing on putting an alata in my collection for being to "plain" and now I see this...
Looks very promising, can't wait for updates!
plant videos: http://www.youtube.com/liguus

Plants in my collection: post186153.html

The following users would like to thank SundewWolf for this post
meizzwang

User Avatar
KategoricalKarnivore

 
Posts: 1725
Joined: Wed Aug 24, 2016 6:00 pm
Location: Beaumont Texas
Thanked: 692 times in 489 posts

Re: BLACK Sarracenia!

by KategoricalKarnivore » Fri Jan 11, 2019 1:26 am

SundewWolf wrote:I've been passing on putting an alata in my collection for being to "plain" and now I see this...

You should take another look at S. alata. Here are some pictures I’ve taken that may help you decide to add some. All S. alata.
Attachments
CEB20174-475F-4C0D-910D-71C8959596A5.jpeg
CEB20174-475F-4C0D-910D-71C8959596A5.jpeg (489.56 KiB) Viewed 637 times
C67C43A0-8411-4C91-91AF-AE3164A60282.jpeg
C67C43A0-8411-4C91-91AF-AE3164A60282.jpeg (621.85 KiB) Viewed 637 times
3D5789E8-7E74-44BB-A7C0-443D9E8DD201.jpeg
3D5789E8-7E74-44BB-A7C0-443D9E8DD201.jpeg (687.99 KiB) Viewed 637 times
B101F901-E832-4A22-96C7-58A1188306B8.jpeg
B101F901-E832-4A22-96C7-58A1188306B8.jpeg (521.73 KiB) Viewed 637 times
54BFA27A-39C7-4793-86B8-0DAA75E131A9.jpeg
54BFA27A-39C7-4793-86B8-0DAA75E131A9.jpeg (968.46 KiB) Viewed 637 times
C2C9DE80-B378-4811-9BA4-6DD48B0F68A4.jpeg
C2C9DE80-B378-4811-9BA4-6DD48B0F68A4.jpeg (237.34 KiB) Viewed 637 times
FC74C1B0-F4E4-4ECE-8AA0-39CC8AF43129.jpeg
FC74C1B0-F4E4-4ECE-8AA0-39CC8AF43129.jpeg (558.04 KiB) Viewed 637 times
A0FBE200-2214-4AEE-AB2F-789B5C108EC6.jpeg
A0FBE200-2214-4AEE-AB2F-789B5C108EC6.jpeg (2.69 MiB) Viewed 637 times
A garden to walk in and immensity to dream in--what more could he ask? A few flowers at his feet and above him the stars.
Victor Hugo, Les Misérables

The following users would like to thank KategoricalKarnivore for this post
bananaman, meizzwang, PitcherPerfect

User Avatar
SundewWolf

 
Posts: 2103
Joined: Fri Mar 08, 2013 2:38 pm
Thanked: 343 times in 311 posts

Re: BLACK Sarracenia!

by SundewWolf » Fri Jan 11, 2019 5:35 am

KategoricalKarnivore wrote:
SundewWolf wrote:I've been passing on putting an alata in my collection for being to "plain" and now I see this...

You should take another look at S. alata. Here are some pictures I’ve taken that may help you decide to add some. All S. alata.


I mean, there is something nice about their simplicity and I have looked at buying one of those alata's with the red hood, but with limited space and a lot of other sarracenia on my wantlist, alata keeps getting pushed back for "maybe one day" .
plant videos: http://www.youtube.com/liguus

Plants in my collection: post186153.html

User Avatar
meizzwang

 
Posts: 145
Joined: Tue Dec 06, 2011 12:56 am
Thanked: 177 times in 75 posts

Re: BLACK Sarracenia!

by meizzwang » Fri Jan 11, 2019 7:20 pm

Thanks everyone!


SundewWolf wrote:
KategoricalKarnivore wrote:
SundewWolf wrote:I've been passing on putting an alata in my collection for being to "plain" and now I see this...

You should take another look at S. alata. Here are some pictures I’ve taken that may help you decide to add some. All S. alata.


I mean, there is something nice about their simplicity and I have looked at buying one of those alata's with the red hood, but with limited space and a lot of other sarracenia on my wantlist, alata keeps getting pushed back for "maybe one day" .


Maybe this might change your mind? Even with limited space, these are some of the showiest Sarracenia species, and the traps can last very long. Below is a fall trap that I photographed this morning! This one of the few clones in the collection that still looks good right now, it's S. alata DARK 'upward lid' Stone Co, MS:
Image

Alata is definitely under-rated, but understandably, that's because these color forms are very rare in cultivation and hard to acquire.

User Avatar
SundewWolf

 
Posts: 2103
Joined: Fri Mar 08, 2013 2:38 pm
Thanked: 343 times in 311 posts

Re: BLACK Sarracenia!

by SundewWolf » Sat Jan 12, 2019 1:31 am

meizzwang wrote:
Maybe this might change your mind?
Image



Well my mind was already changed with the black one lol. I don't hate them but as you said most are just "plain jane" alatas.
plant videos: http://www.youtube.com/liguus

Plants in my collection: post186153.html

The following users would like to thank SundewWolf for this post
meizzwang

User Avatar
Copper2

 
Posts: 400
Joined: Fri Jan 25, 2019 7:02 am
Thanked: 34 times in 34 posts

Re: BLACK Sarracenia!

by Copper2 » Tue Feb 05, 2019 8:14 am

Mike,

I want the first division of that majestic black pitcher plant if you ever offer it. It’s amazing
Don’t kill the insects. I need them to feed my plants

User Avatar
Cross

 
Posts: 1020
Joined: Sat Oct 27, 2018 12:25 am
Thanked: 73 times in 69 posts

Re: BLACK Sarracenia!

by Cross » Tue Feb 05, 2019 1:49 pm

meizzwang wrote:Thanks everyone!


SundewWolf wrote:
KategoricalKarnivore wrote:[quote="SundewWolf"]I've been passing on putting an alata in my collection for being to "plain" and now I see this...

You should take another look at S. alata. Here are some pictures I’ve taken that may help you decide to add some. All S. alata.


I mean, there is something nice about their simplicity and I have looked at buying one of those alata's with the red hood, but with limited space and a lot of other sarracenia on my wantlist, alata keeps getting pushed back for "maybe one day" .


Maybe this might change your mind? Even with limited space, these are some of the showiest Sarracenia species, and the traps can last very long. Below is a fall trap that I photographed this morning! This one of the few clones in the collection that still looks good right now, it's S. alata DARK 'upward lid' Stone Co, MS:
Image

Alata is definitely under-rated, but understandably, that's because these color forms are very rare in cultivation and hard to acquire.[/quote]I need this plant in my life.

Sent from my SM-N960U using Tapatalk

User Avatar
FNGUS

 
Posts: 13
Joined: Sat Oct 06, 2018 1:34 pm
Thanked: 1 time in 1 post

Re: BLACK Sarracenia!

by FNGUS » Wed Feb 06, 2019 1:47 pm

awesome

User Avatar
_-SphagnumFromHell-_

 
Posts: 454
Joined: Mon May 28, 2018 6:02 pm
Thanked: 88 times in 75 posts

Re: BLACK Sarracenia!

by _-SphagnumFromHell-_ » Wed Feb 06, 2019 3:57 pm

Amazing work. I always find plant breeding like this to be fascinating.

User Avatar
crys331

 
Posts: 28
Joined: Sat Feb 09, 2019 3:04 am
Thanked: 2 times in 2 posts

Re: BLACK Sarracenia!

by crys331 » Wed Feb 27, 2019 2:17 am

On my wish list, would love one day to have a very dark/ black sarr!


Return to Pitcher Plants

 


  • Related topics
    Replies
    Views
    Last post

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 3 guests